#duraspace IRC Log


IRC Log for 2010-08-04

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

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[20:01] <tdonohue> Hi all -- Today's DSpace Devel Mtg agenda is up here (if you haven't seen it already): https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/DevMtg+2010-08-04
[20:02] * richardrodgers (~richardro@dhcp-18-111-26-9.dyn.mit.edu) has joined #duraspace
[20:02] <tdonohue> looks like we have a smaller group today...but we may as well get started, since there's quite a bit to go through today
[20:02] <PeterDietz> Hi All. I'm back from holidays. So I'll be getting more involved in 1.7 planning very shortly
[20:02] <tdonohue> yea -- welcome back to PeterDietz and richardrodgers (both of whom have been out for a while)
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[20:03] <tdonohue> hope your vacations went well...
[20:03] <richardrodgers> thanks - mine was great
[20:03] <tdonohue> ok, the first topic on the agenda -- DSpace Global Outreach Committee updates (from after OR10)
[20:04] <tdonohue> I basically wrote up there updates in our agenda notes -- so you can read them there (https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/DevMtg+2010-08-04) -- the main point is that they want to interact more with us
[20:05] <tdonohue> so, they've made some changes -- their meeting notes are now posted publicly on the wiki...they will also be helping with JIRA reviews, for New Features only, to help flesh out the new feature requirements
[20:05] <richardrodgers> should they join (or lurk) these IRC chats?
[20:06] <tdonohue> good point, i've invited them in the past -- we can re-invite them (I think some already read the notes, from what I've heard)
[20:06] <PeterDietz> excellent. I was on the fence as to what RC or developers should be doing with working out new feature requests, but I think global outreach is probably best suited to help out with that
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[20:07] <tdonohue> Global outreach has also tried to distill down a list of "common requested features" (mostly these are just from their committee, but have come up elsewhere in the past). I went through them with Valorie Hollister, and tried to pull out ones that may be possible for 1.7 or 1.8 (many of which we are already working on)
[20:08] <tdonohue> this list is still a bit 'messy' -- but it's posted publicly here: https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/Feature+requests+-+distilled
[20:08] <tdonohue> the "Quick Wins" are items that seem plausible for a 1.7 or 1.8 release (i.e. sometime in the next few releases) -- so, I wanted to let everyone know about this list
[20:09] * valoriehollister (~valorieho@ip68-9-139-187.ri.ri.cox.net) has joined #duraspace
[20:09] <tdonohue> Essentially -- this is another way global outreach wants to help out -- trying to distill down a list of common feature requests, and then work with us to figure out when they could potentially be scheduled for a release.
[20:09] <tdonohue> oh, and here's valoriehollister now! Hi, Val. We were just talking about DGOC updates
[20:09] <valoriehollister> Hi all - sorry I'm a bit late
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[20:10] <tdonohue> So -- if anyone has any thoughts on this list of potential future feature requests (or wants to "claim one"), feel free. I've encouraged Val & DGOC to also enter these into JIRA (those that aren't already there) as they get more details, etc
[20:11] <PeterDietz> is the distilled list ordering to be considered as a particular order? value / easiness
[20:11] <valoriehollister> no particular order to the list
[20:11] <tdonohue> no-- no particular order, actually (despite the fact they are numbered)
[20:11] <valoriehollister> used #s only in case there was to be discussion
[20:12] <tdonohue> valoriehollister -- richardrodgers mentioned a moment ago that we should invite DGOC members to sit in on these meetings as well (if they have time), or review our notes, etc. (I know we did this in the past, but it'd be good to extend that invite again)
[20:13] <valoriehollister> yes -- I regularly extend the invitation
[20:13] <tdonohue> ok -- any thoughts, questions on the DGOC updates? Val and I are working to get more interaction between these groups (as discussed at OR10) -- so, if other ideas come up, let us know
[20:14] <valoriehollister> i think it would be good -- particularly as the DGOC starts to review the "new feature" items JIRA for us all to have an opportunity to discuss
[20:14] <valoriehollister> the DGOC will start their review of the current items at the next mtg on Sep 7
[20:15] <valoriehollister> we hope to move the items along - get them exposure in the community and facilitate discussions
[20:15] <tdonohue> excellent.
[20:15] <PeterDietz> I know I've been out. But I would actually prefer the GSoC projects to get into the code base sooner rather than later. If we have to make a new branch called experimental, so be it (to avoid having a "dirty" trunk). I would prefer to give as much sunlight, and testing/usage to these projects earlier rather than later
[20:16] <tdonohue> PeterDietz -- GSoC projects are actually in SVN -- they are in the "sandbox" area: http://scm.dspace.org/svn/repo/sandbox/gsoc/
[20:17] <PeterDietz> true, true, true. I was sort of pointing to my somewhat laziness, of only wanting to pull from a single tree to get all the features.
[20:17] <tdonohue> ok -- I think that wraps up the Global Outreach talk (at least for today)? we got a lot on the agenda, so I'll move on (but feel free to send comments to Val or I)
[20:17] <valoriehollister> yes, please!
[20:18] <tdonohue> Next up (before GSoC) -- I briefly wanted to give an update to everyone on DSpace/DuraCloud integration work (which has been my primary focus these days).
[20:19] <tdonohue> Essentially, DuraCloud is expanding it's pilot in mid-Sept to many current DSpace users -- this essentially means that these users will be wanting "early access" to the AIP Backup & Restore work which enables our DSpace/DuraCloud integration: https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/AipBackupRestorePrototype
[20:20] <tdonohue> So -- I just wanted to warn everyone that in early Sept I will likely be tagging a "very early" prototype of DSpace 1.7, specifically for these early adopter/testers of DuraCloud
[20:21] <tdonohue> (I've already warned everyone that this tagged prototype may not have all the features of 1.7 -- it will mostly just include the AIP backup/restore work)
[20:22] <tdonohue> So, that's mostly just an FYI -- I have more potential discussion of the AIP backup/restore work later in the meeting (under the 1.7 discussion) -- as much of that code is essentially "ready" to start to merge into trunk
[20:22] <tdonohue> any comments/questions on that? does that make sense?
[20:24] <PeterDietz> this branch is mostly to convert your DSpace repo (data) to be picked by a third party app (Fedora)
[20:24] <tdonohue> no -- this is actually nothing to do with Fedora -- it's just a DSpace to Duracloud connection -- essentially exporting all data from DSpace to AIPs (Zipped up METS), for storage in DuraCloud
[20:25] <richardrodgers> well, it's more to facilitate the use of AIPs generally
[20:25] <tdonohue> and then the opposite -- restoring DSpace contents from AIPs that are pulled down from DuraCloud... it lets people who use DSpace (and are familiar with it) to better understand how it could be used with DuraCloud
[20:26] <tdonohue> (essentially -- in this scenario DuraCloud acts as a cloud-based "backup" system behind DSpace -- you export all your contents for backup...and can restore from it later)
[20:26] <mhwood> It's not meant for interchange between unlike systems. You could dump out an object and its dependents from one DSpace and load them into *another DSpace*, I think.
[20:26] <richardrodgers> you could even use these changes to do local replication (backup)
[20:27] <tdonohue> yep -- exactly -- none of it is really DuraCloud specific -- these changes could also be used for local replication/backup. It's just that I'm rushing to get them in for the Duracloud pilot testing
[20:28] <PeterDietz> ok, I'm square on things now
[20:28] <tdonohue> much more info here: https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/AipBackupRestorePrototype and in my OR10 talk on this: http://www.slideshare.net/tdonohue/improving-dspace-backups-restores-migrations
[20:28] <kshepherd> hi all
[20:28] <tdonohue> cool -- sounds good
[20:28] <tdonohue> hi kshepherd
[20:29] <tdonohue> Ok -- I'll move on for now (let me know if questions come to mind though, or ask richardrodgers or mhwood, as they are helping with the work)
[20:30] <tdonohue> The next two topics are intertwined a bit -- so, we can discuss both. Essentially GSoC is wrapping up (projects have to be done by Aug 16 at latest), and we are also gearing up with 1.7 work
[20:31] <tdonohue> Last week we had a GSoC discussion were we unanimously voted to have the Unit Testing Framework committed to Trunk before the end of GSoC
[20:32] <tdonohue> The other GSoC project which has been recommended to add to Trunk (for release in 1.7) is the REST API work (mdiggory has recommended this addition -- but, he couldn't make this meeting)
[20:32] <richardrodgers> Is the REST stuff in a shape to be reviewed?
[20:33] <tdonohue> From my understanding, yes -- though I need to touch base with Bojan (and I don't think he's here right now). Mark Diggory is in favor of this, and he's been keeping close tabs on the project
[20:33] <tdonohue> well -- it's in "enough" of a shape to start review -- not sure if it's 100% "ready to go"
[20:34] <tdonohue> https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/DSPACE/GSOC10+-+DSpace+REST+API
[20:34] <sandsfish> is this an extension of last year's efforts?
[20:34] <sandsfish> http://oldwiki.dspace.org/index.php/Google_Summer_of_Code_2009_DSpace_REST_Webapp
[20:34] <richardrodgers> ok - thanks
[20:34] <tdonohue> sandsfish -- yes, it's the same student building off of last years work
[20:34] <sandsfish> k
[20:36] <tdonohue> So -- I guess I wanted to get a sense here of what others think. Do we delay this for further (closer) review? Do we just accept it "as-is" for now, and tell everyone that it's a "beta" version of a REST API that we are releasing with 1.7? Or is there some in-between option here?
[20:36] <tdonohue> I know mdiggory (if he was here) would be fighting to get this into Trunk right away, and polish it even more later on (as we've obviously had a tendency in past GSoC to never touch projects again after GSoC ends)
[20:37] <richardrodgers> I'd like to review - but the nice things about REST APIs is that you can version them, so maybe they could ''graduate' to official status later
[20:39] <PeterDietz> I'm for getting the projects into trunk sooner, so that they'll have more eyes on them for longer before release
[20:39] <tdonohue> so, you'd prefer to review it more first? (even though the student may not be around past Aug 16, obviously -- that's the big downside here, is if the review doesn't happen quick, we likely lose access to the student)
[20:40] <tdonohue> PeterDietz -- I think that's also mdiggory's argument here (based on past discussions with him)...
[20:40] <richardrodgers> true - but we are going to maintain it anyway in the long term (if it gets into trunk)
[20:42] <tdonohue> yes -- but the big "if" is what you said "If it gets into trunk". We've never gone back after GSoC (ever) and pulled something into trunk later on -- it could be that this may be the exception to that ongoing problem, or it could just sit there till next year's GSoC
[20:43] <tdonohue> I guess, the more I think about this, I wonder if a "beta" REST API is better than nothing (at least it's something for people to start to play with, and tell us what's wrong with it)
[20:43] <mhwood> I don't see authentication anywhere in there.
[20:44] <tdonohue> hmmm..that would be a problem then -- i overlooked that in my quick review, thanks for pointing out mhwood
[20:45] <tdonohue> i'll ping Bojan about that, and ask him if it just isn't documented yet (I thought I remembered seeing something about Authentication, but it's definitely not on that wiki page)
[20:48] <tdonohue> ok -- should we table this then? I'll ping Bojan, and see if we can get a sense of how authentication/rights are being handled (obviously we don't want this to be a security concern)
[20:48] <richardrodgers> Would be interested to hear his approach at least
[20:49] <mhwood> Sounds like this needs a little more time.
[20:49] <tdonohue> ok -- tabling REST API for now
[20:50] <kshepherd> stuart should be joining in a bit
[20:51] <tdonohue> The only other item I had was to start talking 1.7 in more detail (now that PeterDietz is back)
[20:51] <kshepherd> he did just mention that he thought perhaps auth could be left up to tomcat/apache/etc.. i haven't thought about it hard enough yet. still seems like authZ could be a prob, even if authN isn't
[20:52] <mhwood> HTTP authentication is a (small) subset of the mechanisms that DSpace uses.
[20:52] <tdonohue> aha -- that's good to know kshepherd -- yea, authZ would still be a problem, if that's the case
[20:52] <mhwood> Well, actually DSpace doesn't use HTTP auth at all....
[20:53] <richardrodgers> (only in dark corners like SWORD)
[20:53] <tdonohue> yea, SWORD does HTTP auth
[20:54] <PeterDietz> I would say that 1.7 since its not a feature driven release, will be things that missed the cut from previous releases, works in progress, hopefully some GSoC, and perhaps a few "quick wins" from global outreach
[20:54] <tdonohue> RE: 1.7 -- As mentioned, I have the AIP Backup/Restore code ready now (and I'd like to get more eyes on it & some approval before moving over to Trunk). I updated its JIRA issue just today: http://jira.dspace.org/jira/browse/DS-466
[20:55] <mhwood> CC licensing update -- I think we are on uncertain legal ground if we touch existing licenses. They represent an agreement to which we (DSpace developers) are not a party.
[20:56] <tdonohue> PeterDietz -- yea, I agree completely -- I was just wanting to ping everyone on this again, to start to get work moving into Trunk
[20:57] <richardrodgers> mhwood: true - we would not reassign existing licenses - just 'expose' them differently
[20:57] <tdonohue> mhwood -- good point -- I think a lot of institutions would have concerns over changing the legal agreement there
[20:57] <mhwood> OK, if text is not changed then I'm not worried.
[20:59] <tdonohue> Any other final thoughts today? (Also feel free to send PeterDietz updates on anything 1.7 related you may be working on, if there are updates to be had)
[20:59] <richardrodgers> Looks like curation can launch with 3-4 services: virus checking, checksumming, replication (to cloud), and may some 'micro-services' (from CDL)
[21:00] <mhwood> JIRA review has been starved for several weeks. Could we carve out the *first* 15 or 30 minutes next week for this?
[21:00] <tdonohue> that's great, richardrodgers. I think that sounds great
[21:01] <tdonohue> mhwood -- yea, I'm at a loss as well -- these meetings *always* go long, and yet I'm trying to keep us to an hour (rather than extending to 1.5 hr meeting). But, I agree. We can add JIRA Review for the first 20-30 mins of next week
[21:01] <richardrodgers> We certainly should make sure any important JIRA issues are 'owned' for 1.7
[21:02] <tdonohue> (Originally, I was really hoping that we could do the JIRA reviews a bit more "ad hoc" -- and only bring a few to the meetings for broader discussion, but obviously that idea hasn't quite worked out as planned)
[21:02] <mhwood> OK, thanks.
[21:02] <tdonohue> thanks for asking about it, mhwood
[21:03] <tdonohue> OK -- we'll go ahead and close down for today. I'll stick around here for a while, if anything else comes up.
[21:03] <mhwood> Thanks all, must go.
[21:03] <richardrodgers> thanks all - bye
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