#duraspace IRC Log


IRC Log for 2012-03-15

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

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[6:49] * Topic is '[Welcome to DuraSpace - This channel is logged - http://irclogs.duraspace.org/]'

(manually inserted notes due to DuraLogBot failure...thanks ajs6f)

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[09:04]  http://www.webexhibits.org/daylightsaving/franklin3.html
[09:04]  [ Full text - Benjamin Franklin - The Journal of Paris, 1784 ] - http://www.webexhibits.org/daylightsaving/franklin3.html
[09:06] == ruckus [~ruckus@HSI-KBW-046-005-164-187.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #duraspace
[09:06]  Adam reluctantly agrees to take notes.
[09:06] == ruckus has changed nick to elschlomo
[09:07]  Possible special topic call for fcrepo-store.
[09:08]  Special topic all will be put off for a few weeks to ensure participation.
[09:08]  all -> call
[09:11]  Questions about JCR raised by Mark Diggory on mailing list.
[09:11]  Is Apache Jackrabbit scalable?
[09:11]  Does it support transactionality, and if so, how?
[09:13]  Frank: If we get into JCR, at what level of architecture would it be offered?
[09:13]  Chris: Could be several places. Northwestern implemented it at a high level.
[09:14]  Chris: Could be a JCR-specific implementation for storage.
[09:14]  Chris: Depends on what we want to commit to.
[09:14]  Dan: The JCR semantics are less capable than Fedora's.
[09:15]  Chris and Adam: They're different. "Disjoint"
[09:15]  Chris: Could be good to look at JCR's capabilities and what use it could be, but there's a cost of committing to those extra semantics.
[09:16]  Dan: JCR semantics are a great improvement over Java EE's API-centricity .
[09:16]  Dan: But Fedora is already even better.
[09:17]  Dan: Storage has two parts: authoring (where transactionality  is very important)
[09:17]  and making it accisble to the world (where scalability is important).
[09:17]  accisible -> accessible
[09:17]  Dan: And now we have the cloud, which speaks to the latter, and JCR speaks to the former.
[09:18]  Dan: Tiered storage and asynchronous operations, grading out things for high scalability: these should also be on the table.
[09:18]  Frank: Ala EC2.
[09:20]  Chris: How does Jackrabbit scale?
[09:21]  Adam: Not totally sure-- lots of possibilities of different architectures.
[09:21]  Dan: We can narrow the search space.
[09:21]  Chris: Eddie and Chris have looked at Sling-- not sure where the architectural discussion would lead.
[09:22]  Eddie: Mea culpa!
[09:22]  Eddie: Didn't push the fcrepo-store-util work Eddie has done.
[09:23]  Eddie: Still work in progress-- should be out there to get people thinking.
[09:24]  fcrepo-store-util
[09:24]  is a framework and CLU to do migrations between stores.
[09:24]  Eddie: How to get this kind of CLU to chain?
[09:25]  Eddie: http://jewelcli.lexicalscope.com/
[09:26]  Adam: Might take a look at Apache Karaf shell.
[09:26]  Eddie: Lots of use cases, including changing datastream type, Rebecca's checksum problem, lots of others.
[09:27]  Adam: Change the nature of the Fedora CLI?
[09:27]  Eddie: Maybe, not sure.
[09:27]  https://github.com/cwilper/fcrepo-store/blob/master/fcrepo-store-util/src/main/conf/commands/copy.xml
[09:27]  [ fcrepo-store/fcrepo-store-util/src/main/conf/commands/copy.xml at master · cwilper/fcrepo-store · GitHub ] - https://github.com/cwilper/fcrepo-store/blob/master/fcrepo-store-util/src/main/conf/commands/copy.xml
[09:27]  Eddie: Not enough motivation to do anything major.
[09:28]  Adam: (Shares Eddie's ennui.)
[09:29]  Chris: This is not fully tested, but it shows migration between Akubra stores.
[09:29]  Chris: The code uses Spring configuration, and this could be a general pattern.
[09:30]  Chris: This is also using one approach to pipelining, using filters that are tied together to process.
[09:31]  Chris: Filters can either transform or accept/reject objects.
[09:31]  http://cwilper.github.com/ttff/apidocs/com/github/cwilper/ttff/Filters.html
[09:32]  Chris: This is a filters utility class, which can AND/OR/NOT together filters.
[09:32]  Chris: Was originally written for CloudSync, but the challenge was configuring the workflow.
[09:33]  Dan: How about Apache Camel?
[09:33]  Chris: Have taken a look. That's one reason CHris didn't take the filters too far.
[09:33]  Chris: Lots of alternatives out there.
[09:34]  morning all.  No mic, but on the call.
[09:34]  Hi, Ben!
[09:34]  Bye, Eddie!
[09:34]  Adam/Eddie: Lots of people have been using Camel in the larger community.
[09:35]  Bill Parod (NW), Chris Beer (WGBH), Adam, Scott PRater, others.
[09:37]  Chris: How about some Camel examples?
[09:38]  Adam: Can look at Camel website for good examples, and we can get some from the community (Bill P. and Adam, for example).
[09:38]  Adam: Camel is very strong, very widely used, great DSL, good place to build business logic for pipelining or message-passing workflows.
[09:39]  Chris: The fcrepo-store-util goes pretty much right against the filesystem. There are other ways to do it.
[09:39]  Chris: Please take a look at the utility-- let's get talking about 4.x.
[09:40]  Chris: Questions raised as to what is a core Fedora component. We've tried to keep that small, as an architectural principle.
[09:40]  Chris: So where does a utility like this live? In the same category as Fedora client?
[09:41]  Chris: Until we're ready to recommend and support something, it isn't a core component.
[09:41]  Adam: How about the GSearch model?
[09:41]  Chris: Prefers even more independence.
[09:41]  Chris: Good for these ancillary tools to grow and live outside the core committers group.
[09:42]  Chris: GSearch has a tighter relationship to Fedora's core.
[09:42]  Chris: Thinking of projects that are as "far way" as Blacklight.
[09:43]  Dan: Think of things like tool plugins, maintained by other folks.
[09:43]  Dan: things that have a cross-presence in DuraSpace/Fedora, ala Atlassian's Confluence/Jira plugin libraries.
[09:44]  Dan: They have a clear line as to what they support, but they still foster community and development outside that line.
[09:44]  Dan: Just drawing that line.
[09:45]  Adam: Not as easy for Fedora to offer plugin space.
[09:45]  Dan: Two good places to offer plugin-- at the code level, at the level of shareable objects...
[09:45]  and at the level of the framework.
[09:45]  Bye, Frank!
[09:46]  Chris: Attlassian's plugin ecosystem is quite rich. Just having a central registry would be a good deal.
[09:46]  Chris: How much are we (committers) maintaining collectively?
[09:47]  Chris: We should be empowered to support good things that don't come out of the core development effort.
[09:47]  Chris: E.g. MediaShelf-sourced client.
[09:47]  Chris: Is there an official line we can draw?
[09:48]  Adam: Doesn't think we have one now, but we could create one.
[09:48]  Dan: Atlassian is a good role model.
[09:49]  Dan: People do their own thing, and if it is badly needed, then you might want to take it on.
[09:49]  Adam: We want to be precise about "badly needed".
[09:50]  Chris: This utility is aimed at Rebecca's problem, but if it becomes the official upgrade path for legacy storage -> Akubra, then other committers should be involved.
[09:50]  Dan: Chris has laid out some of the guiding elements for the Fedora committers.
[09:50]  Dan: For 4.x and onwards, how do we make a vibrant community easy?
[09:51] == elschlomo [~ruckus@HSI-KBW-046-005-164-187.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: [BX] Automatically bored away]
[09:51]  Dan: Sometimes it's surprisingly easy to get mindshare by finishing out key extension points.
[09:51]  Dan: E.g. OSGi support, things that provide a framework for extensions.
[09:52]  Dan: Provide shareability for content modeling.
[09:52]  Adam: That's been on the horizon for a long time.
[09:52]  Dan: Hasn't been any motivation because the work has been mature enough.
[09:52]  has -> hasn't
[09:53]  Dan: This utility can be a point at which people can add on their own functionality.
[09:53]  Adam: So it's really important to have a good framework for utilities.
[09:53]  Chris: No urgent Jira issues.
[09:54]  Chris: Let's take a look at Jira.
[09:54]  https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1057
[09:54]  [ [#FCREPO-1057] ECM validation of MIMEType does not allow objects to specify charset if none is specified in the CModel - DuraSpace JIRA ] - https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1057
[09:56]  Chris: Some things need to be resolved, at least it should be specified down to inner syntax for MIMEtypes.
[09:56]  Chris: Let's open it.
[09:57]  Chris: Frank pointed out some cleanup in the use of collections that shold be done.
[09:57]  https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1056
[09:57]  [ [#FCREPO-1056] Unsafe usage of Lists in some classes - DuraSpace JIRA ] - https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1056
[09:58]  Adam: Just some pregenerics baggage.
[09:58]  Chris: Let's open it!
[10:00]  https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1055
[10:00]  [ [#FCREPO-1055] Shared resource for XML operations - DuraSpace JIRA ] - https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-1055
[10:01]  what will be the impact on implementation time to use osgi there?
[10:01]  as opposed to just sharing a compiled xsl?
[10:02]  Adam: Steve and I had a long conversation about this-- good place to put the camel's nose under the tent for reworking resource provisioning for better architecture.
[10:02]  Adam: Could be a place to introduce OSGi micro-services.
[10:02]  Chris and Dan: Yeah, maybe...
[10:03]  Dan: Let's re-own the term "microservices".
[10:03]  Fin.

[6:49] * Set by cwilper!ad579d86@gateway/web/freenode/ip. on Fri Oct 22 01:19:41 UTC 2010
[9:26] * Disconnected.
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[14:16] * Set by cwilper!ad579d86@gateway/web/freenode/ip. on Fri Oct 22 01:19:41 UTC 2010
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[14:20] <cwilper> Hmm..looks like DuraLogBot got disconnected as a result of the ec2 outage this morning. Anyone got today's chat in their scrollback buffer? If so can you send to my nick @duraspace.org please?
[14:22] <cwilper> oh, ajs6f already did...thanks
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